Ep 80 | Why Relationship Marketing is Important

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Are you struggling to build relationships with current and potential donors online? Just because we have to do more online instead of in-person doesn't mean that relationships have to change. In this episode we talk about how to build relationships online.

In this episode you'll learn:

→ ways to build relationships at different stages of the donor journey.
→ how to build trust with potential donors.
→ tools for planning your year

Want to skip ahead?  Here are some key takeaways:

[4:45] Don't forget that just because you're in the digital landscape doesn't mean you can't build strong relationships with people. Focus on them and don't always talk about yourself. Create a relationship that is give and take so they feel a part of your organization and a stronger bond. Remember its cheaper to keep an existing donor than to find a new one.
[6:45] Remember to separate each part of the buyer journey. How you talk and interact with donors at each stage is going to be a little different. From reaching people before they're donors to turning them into repeat donors, having a plan in place for each stage is important.
[10:45] Take time to build trust. Trust goes a long ways to building long term relationships and getting people to understand that you're the best organization to give to for that particular cause.
[13:55] Once they've become donors make sure you've moved them into a nuture phase with them to help them stay connected to your organization. We want them coming back for more.
[12:14] Turn your donors into advocates. Have them help spread your message and get more donors into your circle. Make them feel special like they're in the inner circle. The more important they feel the more likely they'll be empowered to share about you and continue to donate.
[29:56] Build collaborations with other organizations or businesses. This will inherently make your organization more stable and will allow you to get in front of new audiences. It might even open up new funding for you.


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Annelise Worn,

Annelise Worn,

CEO, Annelise Worn

Annelise Worn is a CEO, business strategist, marketing mentor, speaker and mother of 3 little ones. Annelise found herself getting asked for business and marketing advice from women who wanted more freedom in business and life, but didn’t know how to translate that into a viable business model, and take it to the world. Determined to provide a way for small business owners to get affordable access to expert marketers, she founded the Marketing Mentor Program in 2019.

CEO of a highly successful marketing agency, with a background in leadership and wellbeing, Annelise has a unique spectrum of experience that informs and filters through her work with clients. Annelise supports women to transform their business to discover the profit and freedom they started it to achieve. Her true passion lies in developing and implementing efficient, effective, high converting marketing strategies that actually move the needle.

A featured expert across multiple forms of media and events both in Australia and Internationally, Annelise shares her insight via a live weekly video show, ‘The Social Marketing Method', as well as on the Mumstyle Business podcast.

A key thread throughout all her work is the focus on creating a joy filled, impact driven and sustainable business that supports and flows with family life. Learn more at https://anneliseworn.com 

We love creating the podcast. If you like what you learned here please give us a tip and help us offset our production costs.

When you leave a review it helps this podcast get in front of other nonprofits that could use the support. If you liked what you heard here, please leave us a review.

Full Transcript

[INTRO] Hey everyone, Sami here, your host of the Digital Marketing Therapy podcast. And we are talking today about relationship marketing. And I know at times it can feel like a big struggle to build relationships, grow relationships, when you're doing most of your work online when your team isn't even all in the same place and, and still trying to have that level of service, that level of compassion, that level of care that level of all the things as you're working inside of your nonprofit and organization. And so that's what we are talking about today. And I have a great conversation with Annalise Worn all about this.

So Annalise is a CEO, business strategist, marketing mentor, speaker and mother of three little ones. Annalise found herself getting asked for business and marketing advice from women who wanted more freedom in business and life but didn't know how to translate that into a viable business model and take it to the world. Determined to provide a way for small business owners to get affordable access to expert marketers, she founded the marketing mentor program in 2019, CEO of a highly successful marketing agency with a background and leadership and well-being analyst has a unique spectrum of experience that informs and filters through her work with clients.

Annalise supports women to transform their business to discover the profit and freedom they started it to achieve. Her true passion lies in developing and implementing efficient, effective high converting marketing strategies that actually move the needle, a featured expert across multiple forms of media and events both in Australia and internationally. Annalise shares her insight via live weekly video show “The Social Marketing Method”, as well as on the Mum Style Business podcast. A key thread through all her work is the focus on creating a joy-filled, impactful, driven and sustainable business that supports and flows with family life.

We talk so much about why relationships are so important and how they can be impactful at all of the different phases of a donor journey. So I really think that you'll enjoy this episode and just at least have it be a good reminder of how to treat people and how treating people well and building one on one experiences can help grow your fundraising in your organization.

But before we get to it, this episode is brought to you by our Digital Marketing Therapy sessions. These are 30-minute sessions, you can book with me to be able to talk about all the things or anything that you have going on in your nonprofit or organization that you would like some support with. This could be figuring out how to map out your customer journey, how to help build better relationships with organizations how to understand how to create DMs and video messages in Instagram and Facebook. Whatever it is, these digital marketing therapy sessions are here to support you. So head on over to https://www.thefirstclick.net/officehours and book your session now what are you waiting for? Let's get into the episode.

[CANNED INTRODUCTION] You're listening to the Digital Marketing Therapy Podcast. I'm your host, Sami Bedell-Mulhern. And each week, I bring you tips from myself and other experts, as well as hot seats with small business owners and entrepreneurs to demystify digital marketing and get you on your way to generating more leads and growing your business.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Please join me in welcoming Annelise Warren to the podcast. Annelise, thank you so much for joining me today.

[ANNELISE WORN] Thank you so much for having me.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Yeah, I am excited to talk about relationship marketing. I know there's a lot of buzzwords in marketing. But I do think you know, relationships are a thing that are kind of hard to maybe figure out how to navigate in the social space. And, and so why are relationships to you? Like why is that so important?

[ANNELISE WORN] Well, people buy from people, but you're right, it is one of those strange terms that you know, is thrown out there relationship marketing, when really marketing is communication, and we should be talking to people. So there isn't an argument for the fact that all marketing should be should be relationship marketing.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Yeah, I agree with that. And I think sometimes people get hidden behind, I'm not actually talking to you face to face, I'm talking to you through a computer and I don't know who's actually reading it. So like the relationship piece kind of feels lost.

So how do you like why is that something that has gravitated to you? Like, why do you feel like that's really an important thing that people should be paying attention to?

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, so I am I own a marketing agency, but I also mentor small business owners who who want to do it themselves. And what they what I typically find is that they are their small business owners in with services or products that they absolutely love, which is fantastic. But it means that in their in their in their content in their marketing they're talking all about themselves. And they're just ringing the bell because they're thinking that that's what they need to do. And they have such a great product or service that, of course, if they tell people about it, then they'll get sales, and then they very quickly find that that is not the case. Because we, we love to buy, but we don't like to be sold to like to just be be saying like, Oh, you have this offer? Fantastic. Like, how does that relate to me?

You know, and so I really started talking more about relationship marketing with them. And in relation to thinking about the buyer journey, and how do we actually cultivate these long term relationships with people so that we continue to, to have them as customers or clients or donors for for the long term, which is, which is what we want, because it's going to be, it's a lot easier to,
to continue to nurture and go back to that pool of people than it is to start from scratch every single time.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Right? Yeah, it's so much cheaper to find or to keep your existing customers than to find new ones too.

So I guess relationship marketing is different at different stages of like you said, the buyer journey journey, or the donor journey, right? Like how you kind of nurture the first time buyer versus how you kind of nurture the longtime buyer and encourage them to be then vocal advocates and help you acquire new customers.

[ANNELISE WORN] Right? Yeah, I'm so glad you you've closed the loop that because yeah, a lot of people forget about that, you know, referral advocacy component. So yes, first, we need to make them aware of aware of us.

So maybe I'll talk about quickly run through that in terms of, of what we can be doing with content. So at the, at the start, when, you know, people need to become aware of you. And then from awareness, they need to be interested in what you actually have to say, and they have to be can, you know, if they want to, to be involved, then they need to actually take action. And then we need to close the loop with that referral advocacy component. And the awareness side of things without content, we need to build that relationship we can't be talking about, about what we want, or what what our product or service or solution is, or we can't be talking about us in that awareness phase, we need to be
connecting with something in them.

So normally, if you've got a product or service, that will be connecting with that problem that they have. And, and the the outcome that they want. And so in terms of in terms of when we're speaking about donors, what we need to be doing is appealing to, to something that they feel strongly about in the in that awareness phase so that their attention is turned to us. So when Yeah, sorry, I'll stop.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] No, no, you're fine. Don't you feel like that's the big mistake that people make on social media is it's like, you know, buy my product, donate to my organization. And they're not spending enough time kind of sharing content on their channels. That's just explaining why they should even care about the problem that they're solving. Like, if you're a nonprofit that's helping with global warming. People need to understand why they should even care about that before they're going to give you money to help fix that problem.

[ANNELISE WORN] Exactly. And yes, that is the number one problem, I say that people just talk about all about what they need, or what they want, or what they want people to do. And they don't, yeah, they don't bring them into that to their ecosystem before, before they asked for something, and that's why the relationship piece is key, because you once they're in, then they're in by you, and not everyone is going to care about your thing. I mean, they might care but not everyone is going to, you can't give to every possible cause, even though we might lack too. So generally, we're going to pick we're going to pick and choose, you know, a couple to to focus on and so we need to be figuring out who it is that is going to be most like you know, who is the ideal person who's the ideal donor, what are their characteristics, and where are they online? What else do they care about? And then start there and start talking about why it is yours. Why it is that they should should care why it is that they should delve deeper and and become part of your community.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] And so what other pieces at this phase kind of build into that relationship piece like obviously it's you know, being responsive
having great customer service, you know, answering questions as they come through it creating engaging content, but what else might there be?

[ANNELISE WORN] At this phase, it's super important to start to build that trust. Yeah, so I would even go so far as actually connecting with people. So we can go out and physically find them online, and be be speaking with them. So you can go to Instagram, for example. If, if that's your platform, you can go to Instagram, and you can again, going back to Who are these people? And where are they? And who else are they following? What else are they interested in, and be connecting with, with people and engaging with people online, and then when they come over, because if you, if you're engaging online, then your your, your profile is going to come up, your name is going to come up. And so then if, if they come on over to your profile, and they follow you, as soon as they follow you, as soon as they connect with you in any way, send them a message and actually, actually actually DM them.

And, and start that conversation. So you know, we've just released this podcast, we've just or we've just written this article, we thought, you know, you might find it interesting, and maintain that. And every time you produce a new piece of valuable content, or video or something like that, send a link to your followers. And not not a lot of people do this, because yes, it takes time. But those people are following you for a reason.

You know, we're not going to go out and stalk people and just send these messages to random. We can find on the internet, these are people that actually follow you. And you can increase that following in, you know, through advertising, you can increase that following through actually physically connecting. And, and that's where the relationship part comes in. Because you're sending them things that they legitimately will find valuable and cultivating that relationship. And you can have a conversation going, you know, what did you think about that? You know, do you have any ideas? Just be a good person?

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Yeah, and chat, and chat. Right? I love you know, just with the new updates on all the platforms, being able to kind of do voice messaging and direct message because I know, I hate typing. Like, the thing about Instagram that drives me nuts is I hate using my phone for that, but you know, you can very quickly send a quick message to people that have followed you voice message and just say, hey, Jane, like, thank you so much for following us. You know, here's a couple things that you might not know about. And then you know, the cause that you're doing, and just leave it at that. But how important do you feel if somebody took time out to send a quick voice message to you?

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, it's so yeah, it's, that's perfect. I mean, we have a standard message that, that we send, and so we can have an admin person, do that for us. But you're right, your voice message is great. And it really does add that personal component, you know, it's not a robot, you know, it's not right. You know, it's thought about you know, that it's it's authentic, which is, again, people buy from people and people connect with, with people. And the, if they can hear your voice then amazing, because your enthusiasm in your voice is going to be contagious.

And they're going to feel like imagine you you follow someone on Instagram versus you follow someone on Instagram, you get sent a link, you get you get a voice message, they send you something another couple of weeks later. Like the the way that you feel about those two things is is totally different.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Yeah. Okay, so once somebody has become a donor, or has purchased from you, kind of then what's that next step? Like? How do you how do you continue to build that relationship and grow from there?

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, so hopefully, by then you've moved to email. Yeah. So yeah, so that's, I think, in between there, you know, generally you're going to move them to email or you're going to they're going to as they donate, provide their email address and then you can keep them connected. And then making sure that in that content that you are sending your donors that it is really linked to, to stories, stories of a real of the real people that you are helping or the real impact of that that you are making. Because that is again, we were humans and we we are empathetic towards towards other people. So we want to hear those stories of other people or, or animals or whatever it is, and so

We we really want to hear those stories. Because if we're just sending an email out asking for things all the time of going, this is the latest campaign. Well, that gets old pretty quickly? I agree.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Yes. Well, and I think I hear all the time from clients, well, I don't, you know, I don't need to create regular content, I don't need to send out regular emails, like, we don't have the time for that. But I feel like and I think you'd probably agree that the more regularly you send emails out that are just awareness driven, then when you send out those emails that are asking for the purchase, or asking for the donation people are, you're probably going to get a bigger percentage of people that will give or buy, because they've already gotten the value over the course of, you know, the weeks, like if it pays out at the end.

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, and it doesn't have to be you don't have to write some, you know, 2000 page article and has, you know, 27 photos, you can, he can just have one snapshot with a happy person. And an a CT and a bit of, you know, a paragraph or two, like, people don't have time for the lengthy you know, you don't need to produce a half an hour video, or, like, there's a time and a place for all of that. But just in your normal social media, your email communications, just make the time and do it in bulk, like to have someone that, like get an intern something to to create just a short snippets of content that keeps people connected to, to the why. Because otherwise, we're going to lose them, there's too many our attention is, you know, pulled in 5,000 different directions. And so we need to just be giving them things that that make them feel good, it could be a court, it can be a photograph, it can be an article that's not even yours, that has, you know, is about the issue that, you know, this is why we do what we do. And then here's the article link, like it doesn't have to be incredibly produced lengthy content all the time.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Well, and the other opposite to that I would say is you could even do a super lengthy piece of content once a month, and then still pull snippets out of it over the course of a month to share with your audience. So you're still sending them back to the same blog post, for example, right? Like Don't be, you know, share it over and over and over again.

[ANNELISE WORN] Totally, yes, no, definitely do that. 100% do that. Because that is going to mean that I mean, not everyone's going to see your content, for starters, your your open rates, I don't know probably between 20 and 40%. Most, most people they email so not everyone's reading that the organic reach for your social media content whenever you out on a new 10%. And so if you are talking about that same thing or month, that's fine, because it's going to take us a while to you know, potentially have the time to go and read the article, we might need to say the reminder a couple of times.

And if we care about it, then we're going to be totally on board with spreading that message. It's and like spreading that message, it's not going to be something that is annoying or repetitive or, you know, so yeah, definitely break that up. And if you have a blog post, have three points in it and be be distributing those. And make sure that you distribute it in as many platforms as you can. Because every single time you hit publish on some piece of content, that's another line in the water. It's another way for someone to to discover you. And so don't feel like you can't put the same content on on Instagram and Facebook and LinkedIn and what it like whatever your platforms are, you totally you totally can. And again, if people see it in one in one of those places more than they say something more than once. And they're on board with that, like, obviously, they're following you in those places, then they're not going to care because they will assume Of course you have put it in all of the places that your followers and audience are. Because you should be spreading that message because they think, right that you should be so it's not annoying. It's not you know, it's not repetitive. You can totally repurpose. Yeah, and it and it really does help to streamline the whole thing. You don't have to come up with a new idea every week, you know, okay, this week, we're talking all about this, or this month, we're talking all about this issue. And we're going to do it in these different ways. We're going to do it with these different, you know, mediums and media. And, and that's how you can establish a really efficient marketing campaign.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Well, and you might hear numbers like 10% of people are getting social media posts and you know, 20% or so are getting opening your emails and feel discouraged. But it's just another reason why it's important to share things more than once. And it's also a great time-saver, then because you know, you're saving, you're sharing things more than once, you don't have to create new content all the time.

[ANNELISE WORN] Exactly, you're getting it is, it is a little bit disappointing. But, but if you don't share it, no one's gonna see it and you're right, and you're not going to be making any sort of impact, and the people that that like and follow and engage with your content, then they are going to see it and the more engaging you make that content, the more people are going to engage. And then the more Instagram, the more likes, you get the you know all that the more they're going to show it to people. So think about how to make your content, shareable, or saveable.

When you think about the ways that you can really provide value, so that people do save that for later, you know, it's three steps to, to this or three easy ways or, you know, this is a feel good, something like, you know, obviously come up with things that are relevant, but be creative and be and have fun with that. It's not just about posting for the sake of posting, you post things that are going to make people feel good, and bring them closer into being more connected with why you do what you do.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Well, and so that kind of brings us to kind of what you said, closing the loop earlier on then going from Okay, I'm a donor, and I'm a regular donor to now I'm an advocate and willing to share spread, and, you know, magnify your message.

[ANNELISE WORN] Hmm. Yeah, you and we, we love being connected to a cause we love being connected to like a community and being part of a special group. And so I think if we can cultivate that, within, you know, if we have, you know, you have to find a language around
and sprung to mind, which was like inner circle, but, you know, like founding members or like, you know, come up with some language around the fact that you've got these special people, the ones that that are connected, the ones that donate every time the ones that that show up, and give them make them feel special, really appreciate them. And, and, and tell them and tell them that and find a way to make it a bit more of a exclusive kind of, you know, we like to feel good, we like to feel we like to feel special, we like to feel like we've sort of, you know, bust that had that ego boost. And so something like that, that even though it's cultivated, it's still legitimate, and then give them special benefits and give them a reason to, to share that message. And right now with, you know, where we find ourselves in the world. And then in the middle of this pandemic, user-generated content is how we're getting a lot of our, our content in marketing. And so you can do things like competitions, you can do things like, you know, put reposting their posts or sharing their own stories. And and again, how can you make your donors feel special? And special enough that they want to share that? Or what incentive Can you give them so that they share that, that message or what they're doing with their audience? Because if you have 100, great donors even give 10 great donors, then each of those, how many people do they have? Like, how many Facebook friends do they have, and then your message is going to be spread a lot quicker, also, because if as a business profile, people are going to tip us and people are going to see your content, as a personal profile, a lot more than that you're going to save the content.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Yeah. And I think the important thing you're bringing up here, too, is that we have to ask for what we want. Yes, some people will share just out of the goodness of their own heart and their passion for your organization. But if you don't explicitly say like, hey, well, you know, we appreciate everything you've done. Would you please help us by amplifying this man, if you don't give them specifics? They're not necessarily going to do it just on their own?

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, yeah. That we don't think like that. And I think way unless, I mean, sometimes we do when we really invested in it, but really, most of us are quite passive online.

Naturally, most of us would run out, you know, where the vouyers, we just scroll right then rather than than like it and comment, and I know that's not the case for everyone, but it's it's it's more effort. To be liking and following and creating a post, like you said, you know, you don't want to use your phone for typing like, it's, it's a lot. Right? And so and it really does require that that effort and then we've got to think what are people gonna think of us and want to you know, it's it's all of that how is this going to be people get very caught up again, wait, we're eager driven people we just that's what we are. And so yeah some sort of incentive like definitely ask them and then give them some reason to do so because you're giving ideas or because you've you know, you're going to be going into the drawing to, you know, to either to win something or to be chosen for a special feature or to, you know, be VIP in the next event or like whatever it is, give them some sort of reason to, to do it. And they will spread it further.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Well, I think we've seen that in some run walks, right, like people are doing, they're still doing a 5K on their own and raising money for an organization and kind of collecting donor. So you know, kind of encouraging people to use relationships that they have, and build those relationships in kind of a fight, like support me individually, as I'm raising money for this organization that I care about, right. So that can be really amazing and impactful. And then I think I just, I guess for me, it's just really remembering that even though we're in a digital space, there still, like you said, lots of ways to make people feel special.

So do you have any other awesome examples or things that you've seen about ways it doesn't have to be in the nonprofit space, but just ways that people or companies have kind of used even digital strategies just to make an impact and kind of have that personal connection?

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, the other, I'd also say that on the other end of it, I mean, yes, you're connecting with donors, and using relationship marketing to do that. But you can also use social media to build relationships strategically with other with partners and collect to do collaborations or to do you know, whatever it is that you want to, that you want to do.

So you can create those those relationships with people or businesses, that that can help you spread that message. So you know, if you need an event space, then you can be men, you know, cultivating those relationships, you can be cultivating relationships with heads of schools, and that kind of thing. And so more those professional relationships can really be cultivated really, really well on on social media. And it is, it's given the same, it's the same premise with that awareness phase is what do they care about? What makes them feel good? What do they need? In terms of their for them, personally and professionally? Like? Do they have a business that needs a cause? Are they a school that needs a program? You know, is it another is it another nonprofit or Community House that needs, you know, a partner or, you know, like, just think outside the square about you can connect with and use LinkedIn or use Instagram to, to start that, because it's never been easier to speak to people on the other side of the world? Even like, for example, right now? I'm just really, you know, where we're connecting from other sides of Yeah, and it's, and it's not, it's not difficult, it doesn't cost anything except for time to, to start exploring those relationships. And yes, not everyone is going to get back to you. But thinking about those ways where you can communicate not to donors, but kind of side words and build that because those collaborations are going to be really, they're really powerful. It's, it's a way to reach another audience. And for the trust of that, that business or that person to be that transferred to you. The trust that they have from the audience is now is now on you. And so, yeah, I think that that is often often missed as well about thinking about how you can use relationship marketing in that capacity.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Yeah, I love collaboration. I think it's so important. And I think his funds get tighter in giving and in foundations and all of that grants, whatever. Collaborations become even more and more important. And, you know, those relationships that you build with different people in different organizations. You never know what those are going to turn into and what additional people they're going to be able to bring to the table.

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, exactly. And and think long term, you know, when we're going into this relationship building, especially with that, you know, partnership collaboration mentality, it may not come, come to pass now. But just those those connections can can be long reaching, like, for example, we just got a client from someone who I started a relationship with online two and a half years ago, that we've just been touching base every few months. And now, you know, and so you you do need to think, long, long term as well. And think strategically, but then just be be a good be, again, a nice person. Yeah, but just but just do it more than feels natural. Because like I said, a lot of us don't use social media in this way. And we feel like it's just this chore, this thing that we have to do.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] But do you have a system and then just just work the system and find efficient ways to do that?

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah. So I mean, it could be just, you know, you have on your schedule, whoever on your team is responsible for social media, for example, spends 30 minutes every morning, and just gets through whatever they can get through from private messaging, or dming. And, or voice messaging, and things like that, you know, you just get through what you can get through and that 30 minutes every day and know you maybe won't hit everybody, but something is better than nothing.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Exactly, yeah. And just put it in this. Yeah, make the time for it. So okay, so I just wanted to see if we missed anything. So we've talked through brand awareness, we talked through, you know, kind of the stage when they're already donors, kind of creating advocates. Um, is there anything else outside of, you know, building those relationships on social media and encouraging conversations? Anything else that you would, you know, suggest that people put in their toolbox?

[ANNELISE WORN] Um, I think we, I think we covered the, I think, if you do that really well. And then if, as you are, and, and document their results, if you can, yeah. Because for us, so we say, okay, we connected with, you know, 100 people this day, and we did, we did, you know, hundred, whatever, you know, we documented and then see the results, how is the followers changing, how's your engagement rate changing, and then make sure that you're, you know, if you can analyze that and see what people are really connecting with, so that you can make it even even better, you can really make sure that you're giving people what they want, and, and ask them.

And I think that's the key is, I think that people think that social media is just like a platform, you know, like a billboard. And it's, it's so not, it's called social media, and we need to be social. And I think that it is really as simple as that is just connecting person to person remembering that every account, there's a human being on the other side of that, that has, that has needs and feelings and feels and things that they care about and, and to just connect as one human two to one human. And the power of that and, and moving people into action is, is multiplied. It's like that, that drop of water in the bucket that once we harness the power of people, like the work is done, is done for us. But we need to figure out what it is that they care about, and what's going to spur that on. And we're not going to find that out unless we talk with people unless we have those conversations.

And really digging deep about what it is that is going to be the thing that moves people to do something about it not just care about it.


I love just being the reminder of being social on social like that alone, like we forget about that.

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, a lot. A lot of people do and it's never going to be perfect all the time. Of course we're going to be an ebb and flow flow all the time.

But coming back to that, that basic concept and coming back to that buyer journey and thinking okay, awareness, I'm going to be talking about them why they should care. In that middle section consideration. I'm going to be talking more about us and why we do what we do and how we do what we do, and why we're different and, and kind of like you know, the the 10 commandments of our organization. Mm hmm.

And then be big having that call to action. And it's okay to have that call to action regularly because like you said would they don't know what to do if we don't tell them? Like it's okay to lack a post. But what's actually once they go and they care how can they make one small step and starting getting people to start small on social media, with little things that you ask for, you know, share this post, connect over here, you know, read this thing, whatever it is, then it will start some momentum, and then we can move them in closer and Okay, now you're on the email list. Now you're a donor. Now you're, you know, starting your own events, now you're in, and making it easy for people being really creative about how you can make it easy for people to, to make the biggest impact.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Well, and so the last thing I kind of want to touch on,
is when you're really trying to set up in create that impact with people like we tend to, like, you know, the old saying is like, it takes seven times for people to see you before they even remember you and are ready to take action. And I think now I've even heard like in the online space, like, it almost takes 14 to 20 times for somebody to see you before they're willing to kind of take that step. So I'm just curious, your thoughts on that? Because I think people get discouraged. And you know, we kind of touched on this a little bit earlier about sharing your content multiple times. But I think people get discouraged with this, especially with social media, but they you know, just need to kind of keep powering through, right?

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, Yeah, you do. And yeah, the latest stats I heard was like 16 touches a buying decision. Yeah. So yeah, again, if you look at the stats, it's crazy. Like when we were running Facebook ads, we're happy with a 1%. click through rate. Right. Think you, you know what I mean? right? Exactly, exactly. I really, really pull the I mean, we're dealing with the general public. Yeah, you've got to remember social media, we're dealing with the general public. Not everyone is going to care. There's how many billion people in the world, but you don't need everyone, you just need those. You know, I can't remember who said it, but like, the thousand true fans, or whatever it is. And so how can you cultivate those, and yes, come back to the long term, like you're not here, as this flash in the pan, you're not near as, as you know, this year, you might have a goal for this year. But you need to think bigger, and you need to think more long term. And you need to think strategically and just put, get, get a plan in place for, you know, a year or for six months, and work the plan, just just do the plan. And don't look at the numbers. Don't let the numbers sway the plan. Just commit to what you've said that you're going to do. And, and, and do it and outwork it, and then look back on six months and go, okay, where were we? Where are we now? What's working? What's not, where am I going to tweak from here? And then again, keep going with that plan. But don't let you know, Oh, I got three likes, or no one's alive? Or, like, Don't even look at that. That's think, again, why are you doing this? Because the cause is bigger. And if you're thinking about the likes, and the engagement on on one singular post, you're thinking about the wrong thing. And again, we're voyeurs. We don't like, we want something from social media. And then instant gratification. Yeah, but even like, as a business as an organization, we want something from social media. And it's even hard for us to get our butt into gear, to actually, you know, go be commenting and liking and things. So the people we're talking to, they've got no investment, no reason to be active again, they just you can have people that are watching your things for months or years, and you don't have any idea. And then one day, they turn around and they're totally on board, because they've been they've been following along. Like even in my own business.

We've been we were doing a nine day live
workshop. And one of the people that ended up becoming a client hadn't done hadn't commented on anything except for like maybe on the last day and then connected and purchased. So you just you don't know, don't judge the performance based on the numbers. I know. That's all you've got. And you have to make decisions based on those in the longer term. But don't let that impact the way that you feel about what you're doing or don't let that impact the plan in the short term because it's just not. It's not accurate. And we need to we need to it's the whole reciprocity thing we need to know without that, if we want people to engage them, we need to engage. If we want people to connect, then we need to continue to show up. And we need to be trustworthy. And if you, you know, if you're going to post every week and read three days a week, if you're going to be live once a week, you're gonna send an email once a week, like whatever it is, continue to do that and be and get people to expect that before you can expect them to want to, to connect and engage with it.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Well, and I think about to the people that are in my life that I'm closest with that I'm, you know, loyal to, you know, no matter what, and that takes time to build. So if you think about it from just a personal, like how you build relationships in your own personal life, it's gonna take the same amount of effort, if not more online, because people, like you said, are bombarded with so many things and have a hard time building trust with companies unless it's more about that building a relationship with common interests, as opposed to what am I going to get out of it?

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, yeah, exactly. And just be be confident in knowing that. If you if you have valuable content, that's not just asking people for things, then that connection will, will build. And that care factor will build and, you know, then it's like it filling up the bucket, right? If you just need to continuously be filling it up. Otherwise, if it only fits and spurts every now and then it's gonna take a really, really, really long time. A great end, and it might dry out. Yeah, for sure. So, yeah, continuously filling that, that job.

And being committed to your marketing plan, and connecting with people for that long term.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Well, at least I feel like we've given people a lot of things to consider and to take a look at inside of their organization as they start to move through with relationship marketing. If people want to know more about you, and kind of how you help people with this topic, how can they learn more about you?

[ANNELISE WORN] Sure. So I have a Facebook group where I'm live every week. So that's the social marketing method. And I am at anneliseworn.com. So she'll the spelling, you'll be able to find the name of the podcast.

Also, I'm starting a podcast next next year, called Impact Business. And it's going to be about people who are starting businesses to make a difference or, you know, if you're using your, your nonprofit to, like, you know, working business principles into that. So if anyone wants to touch base in regards to that, I would love to hear from them.

[SAMI BEDELL-MULHERN] Awesome. And we will link all of this stuff up in the show notes at https://www.thefirstclick.net/podcast. So you can absolutely check out all of those links. But thank you so much, Annelise. This was a great conversation. And I think just a great reminder for people to not be discouraged by the distance in being mostly digital, and that relationships and strong relationships can still be built with customers.

[ANNELISE WORN] Yeah, thank you so much for having me. It's been fun.

[CLOSING] I want to say another thank you to Annelise Worn for joining me on this episode. I hope that you got some great nuggets from it. It was some great reminders for me on you know how I'm showing up on social media and what I'm doing to engage with my followers and new followers. But for now, I hope you'll subscribe wherever you listen so you don't miss an episode and make sure you head on over to https://www.thefirstclick.net/podcast to check up on the show notes from this episode and all the other episodes that you may have missed. I'll see you in the next one.


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