Ep 233 | Reflecting on 2023 to Plan for 2024 with Julie Boll

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When you reflect you remind yourself about what was amazing, what you want to do more of, and what you'll let go of. Walk through the exercises in this episode for yourself AND with your team as you plan for 2024. Then, create this as a practice throughout the year to make adjustments and changes as you work towards your organizational goals.

What you'll learn:

→ what is a reflection practice?
→ how often you should be reflecting.
→ questions to ask yourself when reflecting.
→ using what you learn to help you when you aren't hitting your goals.

Want to skip ahead? Here are key takeaways:

[3:30] Why is reflection important? It helps you understand what worked well and what didn't. As you go through life, you tend to forget what happened in the day-to-day that positively or negatively affects your personal and professional goals.
[7:56] As a leader, you need to model the work. Yes, you can lead your team in this exercise. It makes a bigger impact if you do the work yourself and model that for your team.That will help you build a culture of ongoing reflection as you go through the year.
[15:17] Create a better breakdown of your fundraising goal to know who to target. If you're looking for a certain amount of donors at a certain average gift then you can track where you're at and which audience you should be targeting.
[11:23] Figure out the right cadence for yourself. Julie recommends at a minimum, a quarterly review. Take quick inventory on what you intended to happen and what actually happened. Think about what you will keep doing and be real with yourself about what you'll let go of. 
[13:53] Start by getting out a piece of paper and asking yourself questions. Some questions include, what are you most proud of? What did you learn that you want to take with you? What milestones did you achieve? Where did I develop a skill that I want to expand on.
[20:57] Be real about what you come up with and use it to pick yourself up if you aren't hitting your goals. By reflecting you get a better understand of what isn't working so you can make adjustments and keep the train on the tracks.


[quiz] Should You DIY Your Website?
[guide] Year In Review

Julie Boll

Julie Boll

Founder, Julie Boll Consulting

As a certified Dare to Lead facilitator (CDTLF), Julie Boll teaches people how to lead and live more courageously using the Dare to Lead framework developed by Dr. Brene Brown. Julie is the founder of Julie Boll Consulting, a consulting firm dedicated to helping people and organizations make the most of their time, energy and resources so they can maximize their impact on the community. Julie is a former grants professional with a $10 million track record in awarded grants and over 20 years experience in the nonprofit sector, serving in marketing, public relations and grant development roles. Julie is a Certified Professional Co-Active Coach (CPCC), and McNellis Compression Planning® facilitator. Julie holds a Bachelor's Degree in Public Relations and a Masters Degree in Education, both from Quincy University. Learn More: https://www.juliebollconsulting.com 

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Full Transcript

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] It's definitely a crazy time of year we're trying to get through year end giving but also planning for 2024 and the upcoming year. So I have Julie bowl on today as my guest talking about reflection and how we can use reflection to help push us through the end of the year celebrate our wins, learn from the things that didn't work as well as we wanted, and have a better 2024 to make sure we smash our goals and keep things moving forward.

Julie Boll is a certified dare to lead facilitator and teaches people how to lead and live more courageously using the dare to lead framework developed by Dr. Brene Brown. Julie is the founder of Julie Boll consulting a consulting firm dedicated to helping people and organizations make the most of their time, energy and resources so they can maximize their impact on the community. Julie is a former grants professional with a $10 million track record and awarded grants and over 20 years experience in the nonprofit sector, serving in marketing, public relations and grant development roles. Julie is a certified professional co active coach CPCC and a McNeil's compression planning facilitator. Julie holder holds a Bachelor's Degree in Public Relations and a master's degree in education both from Quincy University, I think you're going to love this conversation. It's not going to require a lot of work for you to put this into action, but you're going to see results in your business and in your organization and in your personal life by practicing reflection, and understanding how to take the things that you've accomplished that went great and that didn't go so great, and how to use them to do better as you move forward.

So I really hope that you enjoy this episode. It was a lovely conversation. It went by so fast. I probably could have talked to her for hours.

But before we get into it, this episode is brought to you by our quiz should you DIY your website. This quiz allows you to ask answer the questions about what it is that you have time budget, staffing, Tech Tech experience all the things in order to have the website of your dreams it's going to help you convert more visitors into donors. It's going to tell you if your idea wire a done with you or or done for you are those are real words, right? So go to https://thefirstclick.net/quiz. Take the quiz and find out how to best support your website moving forward and get more conversions. Let's get into the episode.

[Intro] You're listening to the digital marketing therapy podcast. I'm your host, Sami Bedell-Mulhern. Each month we dive deep into a digital marketing or fundraising strategy that you can implement in your organization. Each week, you'll hear from guest experts, nonprofits, and myself on best practices, tips and resources to help you raise more money online and reach your organizational goals.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] Hey, everybody, please join me in welcoming Julie Boll to the podcast. Julie, thanks for being here.

[Julie Boll] I'm so happy to be here. Thanks for having me.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] Yeah, so today's kind of more of a mindset kind of thing. But like really being thoughtful about how we approach our upcoming year. And so I'm really excited about this conversation because this is a practice I do in my business. And I think not something that is obvious for a lot of people. You know, we don't want to think backwards too much. But why? You know why reflecting and like thinking about how far we've come? Like, why is that something you love so much?

[Julie Boll] Yes. So the end of the year practice or just a reflection practice in general is so powerful because what you do is you take a look at like major moments and milestones. You don't have to put it in buckets of work or poem or what. But just like what, what took place this year, I think we're so busy living our lives, and building our lives that sometimes we forget to like actually take stock. And it's incredibly strategic to do it. So, you know, in strategic planning, which I do with nonprofits, I walk him through this all the time. But individually, we kind of forget to do it for ourselves. So it doesn't matter what you do. I just think this practice is so healthy to take a look at your year, your major moment your milestones. And notice moments and milestones don't have to be good or bad. Just what came up this year. You know what, what did you experience and actually intentionally reflect on it and verse, celebrate and then be intentional about what you want to take forward from that. It's interesting, it can be a 20 minute exercise, or it can be a two to three hour exercise. But yeah, I love this practice. I walked through my coaching clients with it, a lot of it. I've done it in live workshops as well, and it just gives people a chance to recognize what they have achieved and then kind of again, learn from what was it that really let you be, you know, wherever you are energetically, really alive. Mm hmm.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] There's so much to unpack here. And we're gonna get to all of it. And I'm so excited. But I want to make sure we touched on this at the very beginning, because I think going into year end giving, especially this giving season, which feels very uncertain for a lot of people, we can feel very down deflated, frustrated, and live in the moment of where we're at right now. Versus like, what have we done? So, like, why is right now the perfect time to do this, just even to build up team morale and like push through to finish the rest of the year strong.

[Julie Boll] I think again, it comes to energy. And it's an opportunity to celebrate where we are today. So in fundraising, and you know, even if we set these goals for ourselves, and sometimes it's like, if we haven't achieved that goal, whatever it is, we're not successful. So this year in practice really allows you to just pause and say, What am I proud of, you know, and it might be, I got thrown this huge curveball, which was my story and my business. And my business is still here. It's amazing. You know, life really took a turn, I didn't expect it to take this year and the business sustained itself. And I'm really proud of that, you know, the metrics have to go out the window for a moment, I have to pause and look at what what that growth means. For me. It actually reminds me of a practice in Brene Brown's work called Writing SFD Shini. First Draft, sometimes we have this story about what we've accomplished. And when we stop and actually take inventory. We're like, oh, man, she look what I did. I did this new partnership, I did this, I did that. I earned whatever this is. Got my kid into this program, whatever it might be some I think, I would argue most of us would be kind of impressed. If we take the moment. And that's the energy you want going into the end of the year is like this. Celebratory, yeah, you were doing good work. And we want you to come on board.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] Yeah, so we're going to talk through some ways to like start doing this practice. But I want to touch on just something you said with regards to like, the importance of doing this individually for ourselves on a personal professional level, as well as us as leaders, kind of encouraging this practice for our team as a whole, right? So if I'm a leader of an organization, like how can I kind of encourage this experience in this conversation, and then encourage my organization to kind of do this and take stock on this on their own?

[Julie Boll] Yes, I love that. And so it's interesting. I just had a conversation yesterday, on the beyond the donation podcast where we talked about this exact same concept. So as a leader, I think the most powerful thing you can do is do the work for yourself, actually, and so we so I see this all the time with leaders.

Basically, this idea that I won't do the work for myself, but I am open to other people doing it. Nope. Do you got to do it yourself. So actually going through the process of identifying your own wins and celebrating your own wins as a leader? Then walk your team through that. And, you know, what are we most proud of? What what are some of the things? What are the skills that we learned? What were some of the challenges we overcame? Where are we stronger because of it? You know, and then what do we want to be intentional about in the next year? And maybe we found out that doing, you know, LinkedIn lives was something that we just really enjoyed, and got really authentic responses from, how do we protect that next year instead of it's just one more thing on my list?

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] So super powerful. Yes, I absolutely believe that can be done individually and together. But in order to lead it for team you have to believe in the practice and actually do it yourself.

[Julie Boll] Well, and I think the other part of this you know, there's been a lot of conversations in my world with other consultants in the nonprofit space is this idea that a lot of people in the nonprofit world don't feel safe to fail fast and to kind of try new things and get out there so I think another part of this practice can be like what did we try that worked? Well, what did we try that didn't work well and why from a all from a positive perspective, right? Not from like a you did this, you did this, but like, what did we learn from this? How do we want to how do we want to take it forward? Yes, and that alone is a beautiful practice and in creating a culture where it's okay to experiment. So if we think about innovation, we want innovation in all of our spaces. Innovation is putting new ideas out there that have not been tested, you're going to fail if you're an innovative environment. So instead of saying, do we achieve our goals or not and say, What Are we proud of where, you know, where do we see growth? And where do we see challenge? And what do we want to do with this? That's that sort of learning mindset. The other thing that's interesting is, when we talk about daring versus armored leadership in the dare to leave work, we look at what environments foster, and one of the things is. We don't celebrate milestones. And we don't stop to celebrate. And we can perpetuate that as a culture. So by doing this practice, you're really embedding a healthy cultural practice of stopping, reflecting, celebrating and learning instead of just forge ahead.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] Well, and this is a good practice to do at year end, but like, is this something we should be doing? All year long? Like, How often should we be kind of reflecting on where we're at and taking stock of where we're at? You know, I think that's a very individual question. I follow someone who does a quarterly review, and I've adopted her practice in my business. And I personally really liked that cadence.

[Julie Boll] It's, again, just taking a quick inventory on what your intentions were for the quarter. And then what are you most proud of, you know, what came up? We know if anything, that life is unpredictable. And so really, to be able to say, this is what happened black and white, put it on paper? And this is what I want to take from it. I think there's just tons of power in doing that. Yeah. And then how important is it to be really real with ourselves on like, I mean, you touched on this a little bit like, these are the things that we're going to keep doing because they've been serving us. But these are the things that aren't serving us and like giving us the permission to let go. Yes, yes, I think that's the key right there. And that is deceptively simple. Use the word permission in the daily work, we actually write out permission slips for ourselves. And it's one of those things, you know, I've been a fan of Dr. Brene. Brown for 10 years. And I believe in all of her practice, but I didn't actually put them all into practice. But I've, I've used a permission slip to actually write down, I get my permission, or I give myself permission to set this thing down whatever it is, can be incredibly powerful. The other thing is the Are we being real? So there's a really beautiful reality checking tool that Renee uses. And I mentioned it earlier. It's called the SF dt, which it stands for shitty first draft, if that's not allowed on the bike as stormy. But essentially, what's the story you made up in your head? And then you fact check it, and you just write down the facts. It is such a powerful exercise. So it's in the same family of the urine, radiant concept. But you can do it when you're hooked in a moment. And what it does is it just it forces you to get honest with yourself, and challenge the stories that you make up that really drive your behavior.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] Yeah. Okay. So let's get into the granular of it. If I'm listening to this, and I'm like, okay, yeah, I'm all in, I want to do this with my team, or I want to do this for myself, like, where do we start? And how do we kind of put this into action? Absolutely. So the easiest way for me to walk through getting granular with us is just the person I'm talking to see me. So do you are going to do this practice, I would say first start with you. And literally, I would say get out a pen and paper, get your calendar out. And take a look at this last year. And write down all the major moments, the major milestones. And that's all you do. So five minutes, 10 minutes, whatever you need just to write down what comes up. And then I would ask you a series of questions. And those questions are going to be

[Julie Boll] what stood out to you, when you wrote those down? What are you most proud of? I actually don't have the questions in front of me. So I'm like, what are all the questions? The questions and attract I have this year and review as a handout that I can share and we can make publicly available. I would be asking or you would be asking yourself a series of those reflection questions. And just a question What are you most proud of like I mentioned earlier that

Last year, it took a turn I didn't expect it to take, I really am proud that the business is still healthy. And it just takes you a step back. So that you own for yourself, what are you most proud of? And then basically the learning pieces, what do you want to be intentional about taking forward? And that's it. It's that simple. So you do it for yourself. And then you walk through with the team. And you have the team share what the major moments and milestones were, and you have the team answer those questions of what, what am I most proud of? You know, where did I develop skill, you know, we know all of those scenes contribute to the outcomes that we want. But sometimes we're in the middle of it. And so we have to acknowledge the growth without the outcome.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] If you do that, with your team, like what you're going to learn, like what they're going to say, might surprise you, right, like different things that are going to come up from everybody. That's not all exactly the same. And it's going to also help you get to know your team a little bit better, as far as like, what they what they find value in so that you can continue to motivate and lead them forward, you know, in the coming year? Yes. And you might find out something really light someone up that you didn't know about. And as a team leader, want to leverage that in the coming year? How do we hold space so that you can do more of that? Because that's gonna have a positive impact on the organization as a whole?

[Julie Boll] So how if, if we also want to have the conversation of, you know, maybe what didn't work as well as we wanted? Or what new ideas do you have? What advice would you give to leaders as far as how to facilitate like a positive environment and a safe space for those kinds of conversations?

This is where you have so much power as a leader to model this work. So you are going to model to taking stock of the situation, you know, reality checking, and being intentional about what do we want to learn from this? How do we want to carry this forward, so that we're not saying pass fail, we're saying, let's use this experience, and be strategic moving forward. But if you model that work, you're going to create a space where one it's okay to fail or to not meet your metrics. And the only way that you can truly give people permission to do that is to own up on your own stuff. And say, this is this is where I wanted to be. This is where I am today. Here's what I'm taking from it. When you when you can be transparent and vulnerable. You give other people permission to do the same, huh? Yeah.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] And I think that's critical, because so many nonprofit, especially in the development space, they live from such a scarcity mindset space of like, well, we are, you know, we lose this donor, we're done. Or if we don't get this grant were done. And so I think that's a great way for leaders to model that. Okay, well, we didn't get this what's our next like, what's next? Like? Where are we going to? How are we going to do this and have positive conversation? So I love that modeling. I think that's critical. And so important. So you mentioned kind of doing this on a quarterly basis, maybe you do this with your team on a quarterly basis? And then do you kind of put all of that information somewhere, so it's easier at the year end? Like you can then go back and reference it reflect?

[Julie Boll] Absolutely, absolutely. So I will speak from doing coaching exercises with business owners, that we absolutely capture that that information. And how that would apply to a team environment is really going to be how you structure your check in times. And so I do see a lot of organizations I work with where their check in times, or their meetings are almost kind of a show in town. And you gotta shifted away from show in town, you can read all this information before coming in. We don't need to all stand up and read our reports or prove our worthiness, what we need to do is use the collective energy in the room to again, celebrate and be intentional about planning forward. So yeah, however, your meeting structure works, have just a running agenda, a running place that you capture those winds and those intentionality and put them on the next quarter roadmap of whatever type. One thing I will say is you don't really see the kind of planning framework in the nonprofit space. And I think it would greatly benefit nonprofit organizations to do this kind of planning as you would in more of a business environment.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] No, and I agree with that, because I think especially in the nonprofit space, we don't necessarily like, we have several different campaigns or things that we're trying to raise money for. And if we don't hit that goal, then we're like, okay, we automatically failed, and stead of seeing green that practice to be okay, we didn't hit this number. But let's be really thoughtful about why we didn't hit this number or let you know, what do we need to adjust next time and in the reverse, when we exceed a goal? It's awesome. We exceeded the goal, like we just cheerlead. We also don't reflect to say, Okay, well, what were the elements that allowed us to exceed that goal so that we could replicate that moving forward?

[Julie Boll] Yes, and one thing, just as well as like beating ourselves up for not meeting the goal, I think the other trap we fall into is almost like, let's not get too excited when we reach the goal. And then we move the finish line. And we're like, okay, yeah, we're going for this. And we're going for this. And I was like, for goodness sake, you never get to win. And if you're and I do this all the time in my business, I'm like, check. All right. Now, this is my goal. And startups pausing in the moment. So even I think it works for both, it's healthy for both, maybe you didn't meet it, maybe you blew it out of the water. But goodness, let's stop and celebrate.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] Well, and I think what I love about to your quarterly practice and reflection, and not just waiting to your end is also in I know, you mentioned, we don't celebrate milestones, but like in those quarterly sessions being like, hey, you know, we haven't hit our goal yet. But we have hit where we we have, we can celebrate that we've exceeded where we're supposed to be by now. And I'm and maybe that's, you know, semantics and terminology, and whatnot. But yes,

[Julie Boll] yeah, maybe touch on that? Well, in? Yes. Um, so when we do strategic planning, we basically have indicators, you know, leading and lagging indicators. So, at the end of the day, you want to reach x, but it's not that you want the money, it's that you want the impact that you're gonna have on your clients that you serve?

What are those indicators you want to track that are showing that we're, we're moving in the right direction? And which ones do we need to jump in and address so that again, once a year, course correction is gonna be a little harder. But Quarterly, we can take a look at those metrics and say, Okay, again, here's what we're celebrating, here's where we want to make a few shifts. And, you know, we got to have things to celebrate other than that, that big cash prize at the end, you know, yeah, we hit that big goal. What else? You know, there's just ways to break down those metrics, so that we can track and celebrate our progress.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] Well, and to that point, what would you say to people that are working in a space, like, let's say you're, you're working in food insecurity, like, you know, your ability to fix that problem is broad, like, you can't fix that problem, you can make a dent in it. And you can make a big impact, but you're not going to get rid of as one organization, food insecurity, for example, right? You can't adopt out all of the dogs like, so I think a lot of times too, we get caught in this trap of okay, well, I did all this work. But there's still all of these people in this community that aren't being served. So like, what would you say to those folks, when it's like, well, I can't celebrate this, because there's still so much work to be done.

[Julie Boll] You hit the nail on the head, I think this is a common thought. And I would say to that person,we are not helping the person that we want to help by not celebrating artwork.

And we are not helping that person, if we are punishing ourselves in the midst of it. So the whole idea of self compassion and self love. Like you have to be able to show up in your best self to do your best work for this cause that is so important to you. And that means you do have to start adopting these healthy practices. You have to celebrate your wins, you have to learn, you have to go home.

So exhaustion as a status symbol is one of the things that comes up a lot when I do workshops and people resonate with it and like Guess what? You're not really helping your bottom line. This is how you're operating because you or potential to have impact diminishes when you create an environment of burnout and exhaustion for you and your people. That's not helping the people you want to serve.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] Because that's leading you to burnout. And if you are, if you're leading yourself to burnout and leading your team to burnout, then you're not going to be to be able to provide that impact, right?

[Julie Boll]  Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. So hold on to hold on to that fierce energy and love that you have for the people that you serve. And know that one of the most strategic things you can do is take care of yourself and your team. So you can,

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] yeah, um, I love this all so much. And I feel like it's something that may might feel a little bit out of the norm, and icky so or like, just kind of awkward, I shouldn't say icky, but maybe just kind of awkward. So how, like, you know, how many times we maybe want to work through this practice before it becomes a rhythm and feels like it's just second nature? Like, you know, don't just do it one time and be like, Well, that was weird. So we're not going to do that again, right?

[Julie Boll] Yes, I'll supply a natural, it may feel natural. Yeah. And how many times do you have to do it for it to feel natural? For one, you have to do it with others. So you know, make a commitment to doing it with your team and being awkward at it and systematizing it. The other is, if you're on your own, or you don't run a team, find someone to do this work with. Because once you see them do the work, and you support them doing the work, it's going to feel less natural.

Yeah, so I would say honestly, we got a workshop this last weekend, with about 100 grant professionals, and they were in every different walk of their careers. And honestly, I think in one hour just doing the practice changed how they felt about it. So don't underestimate that just making space and setting the intention to do it. could surprise you?

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] Yeah. So do it with your board at your board or treat doing it with your team doing it with if you have Corps volunteers, like, you know, is it like, could it be positive to have like your whole staff and board? Do this exercise together? Or would you recommend kind of having it be two separate types of engagements and interactions?

[Julie Boll] You know, I do think that reflection as a board is really powerful. And, in fact, when we do board retreats, we often start with storytelling. And we want them to tell us a story about something meaningful. And it changes the whole energy in the room. So again, you think of board it same with donors, there's kind of this authority to it. But these are people that are passionate about the cause, giving them time and space to reflect and answer those questions, I think is really effective. I think it looks I think the questions look a little different. But it's the same concept as what the individual reflection would be. And, you know, you can actually lead this work in a group setting, with an individual focus as well, where we essentially say we're going to walk through it. So we all have our big takeaways, and then we're going to share those that feel compelled to share, and then there's just a lot of meaning in the room when that happens. Yeah. Yeah, no, it's beautiful. So once we've kind of done this reflection, where can we know how we feel about what we've accomplished? What worked? What didn't? How do we take that information into our upcoming then 2024 Planning to make better decisions for kind of what we want to do in the coming year? Yes, so we have to design a place to capture this. And we have to design a practice to refer to it. A lot of times when it's strategic planning people are like it goes on a shelf. So for me, it's basically a one page document where I can put all this intentionality for the next year in place. And then on my weekly planning, all set intentions for the day, and I'll be able to connect it back to those big purposes. So everybody looks different. It's interesting was strategic planning and nonprofits and kind of thought I was going to come up with a perfect template that was going to work for everyone. And that's it doesn't work. Some people want a lot of details. Some people don't. And so I would boil it down to one place to capture it, inspirational language and then a weekly Any practice where you are referring to it, and it's like a rubric or decision matrix that helps you filter, all the different things that you're dealing with the potential projects you're taking on in the grant world, you know, we always wanted to raise more money, but it wasn't always a good fit. So it's kind of nice to have. Okay, is this really going to align with our intentions for next year? Because maybe we would have more, we want to create more space to launch a new program? Well, if that's the case, we can't keep burning ourselves out on growing the existing one, you know?

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] Yeah, I love that. Um, I just think I hope people are listening to this and like, resonating, because the beauty of this is that it's such an easy thing to do. It just takes intentionality, but can make such a big impact on how we think and work as a team, how we think and work in our own purposes, how we think and work moving forward. So I just, I just think it's a beautiful thing. So I'm so grateful that you came and shared this with everyone today.

As we kind of wrap this up, what kind of final thoughts might you want to share with folks or kind of what? What additional strategy might you want people to consider as they kind of make this part of their regular routine?

[Julie Boll] So I would challenge you to text someone, or emails online today, that you think would do this with you, and schedule something before the end of the year, send them the worksheet, and show up and do it, that's what I would recommend. You're going to learn something from the process. And then from there you can build. So yes, there's a worksheet that I can send out we can make available, that just walks you through that process of taking inventory, and reflecting and celebrating and then being intentional about the learning about that.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] And we'll link that up at https://thefirstclick.net/233 for everybody. But Julie, there's so much more that we have I mean, we've just barely scratched the surface on this and all the work that you do if people want to connect more with you and learn more about the work that you do. How do they do that?

[Julie Boll]  Yes. So my name is Julie Bowles. So you can go to https://julieboll.com, or find me on LinkedIn and follow me there. And basically support nonprofit organizations in this courage building work, which is based on Dr. Brene Brown, and her framework and strategic planning. And then I also support the consultants that serve nonprofits because there's a like, there's a whole nother set of baggage that can come with serving just like what you said before, how can I stop and celebrate when the people that you know I'm trying to help are still suffering. So there's kind of that mindset sometimes when there's consultants in the space.

[Sami Bedell-Mulhern] I love that. And again, we'll have that all linked up in the show notes. Julie, this time went by so fast. But I thank you so much for sharing your wisdom on all of us in this time, and I think now's the perfect time to just have this reminder because we are in the throes of a busy time of year. But that doesn't mean it's not time to celebrate and learn. So thank you so much for being here.

Thank you. Big thank you again to Julie for being my guest today and taking time out to chat with all of us about reflecting in this practice of reflection in our planning, you can grab the resources she mentioned at https://thefirstclick.net/233 Make sure you subscribe wherever you listen to this episode or on YouTube so you don't miss out on any episodes or the bonus episodes that we have. We have two bonuses that come out every single month. And while you're there, subscribe and leave a review. It helps us get in front of more nonprofits that are looking for digital marketing support, just like you for now. Thank you so much for listening, and I'll see you in the next one.

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